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YouTube Comments - 51 Comments
Top Comments of this video!! :3
To give my own fantastical example - Ciri from Witcher has gray hair. She's at her oldest (from the events we know of) 22 years old and never had children but she always had gray hair. By that definition, she would become a grandmother if she just started giving out hard candy.
And so would anybody in the real world that cosplays as her or just decided to dye their hair as gray.
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I'm a 34 yr old male grandmother. According to this definition.
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Contextualizing fantastical/impossible counterexamples wrt the notions of logical impossibility, metaphysical impossibility, and nomological impossibility would've driven the point home even further, but I guess that would've also added to the complexity of such a simple, easy-to-understand video.
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What a great video! I would like to know more about other philosophical tools as well
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I totally disagree about impossible examples disproving concepts that way. There is no concept at all worth thinking about, beyond basic definitions that is valid if impossible examples disprove them.
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Luv this! It's like having a sledgehammer. Although I don't like to be intellectually dishonest, how do you balance this.
But it's a great technique for putting people on their heels!
Thanks. Enjoy your lectures.
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Excellent. Thanks.
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A few of the commenters have taken umbrage with allowing fictional examples to be used to disprove things. I will also take umbrage. Literally everything can be disproven if you can make up something to disprove it. It's particularly problematic in politics and business. I've been guilty of using unrealistic hypotheticals that cause me to make less than optimal choices. As I've gotten older, I've gotten better at knowing what the chances of something really happening are. So if fictional examples are allowed, then experience has no benefit for humans.
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So are counterexamples only capable of proving analytic claims false? How does the analytic/synthetic distinction tie in with this? Thank you for your reply, and in general, thank you very much for your very helpful video series.
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Coming here from watching other videos where Kaplan has used counterexamples. This video is uncontroversial enough, but with regards to its actual use in philosophy, there's one glaring issue I was hoping would be addressed in this video but isn't:
When a counterexample is raised, is the theory refuted, or is it the counterexample that is faulty? It could be that the counterexample does not actually contradict the theory, or it could be that the counterexample simply makes assertions (usually out of intuition) that can be refuted, especially by the theory itself.
Example, coming from the video on Hedonism: A supposed counterexample to hedonism is to have two actions A and B such that intuitively, A is more good than B, but by hypothetically assigning a greater pleasure to B than to A, B is more good than A. A hedonist could reply that the counterexample doesn't work because either the intuition is wrong that A is more good than B, or the pleasure assignment is wrong and it is A that should have a greater value than B.
idk if hedonism ever goes into more detail about how they measure pleasure (which imo is one of the weak points of hedonism anyway). If only they were more specific, then maybe a counterexample can be effective.
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Any grandma not handing out hard candy is NOT cool.
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I am a bit puzzled that you did not mention the very influencial critique on this form of conceptual analysis that relies somewhat on an appeal to intuition, particularly naturalistic arguments. I guess it is fair to say, that this use of counterexamples is at least extremly controversial, even if you dont agree with some approaches of experimental philosophy or strict quinean views, and a lot of philosophers today do not see the value of such an investigation (but they probably would support what F. Jackson called modest conceptual analysis).
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Your statement regarding the counter example of "Knowledge is justified true belief" is flawed. You said that the counter example of "Justified True belief is Knowledge" is equivalent to the counter example of "Knowledge is justified true belief".
We know that "A square is a rectangle" cannot be disproven with a counter example. However, "A rectangle is a square" can be disproven with a counter example.
Your valuable comments would be highly appreciated in case I have misunderstood your lecture.
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People tend to dismiss counterexamples by saying what they're putting forward isn't supposed to be a general claim but only meant to be a typical observation when they're trying to fit each individual case into this "typical observation" that's based on probability... I mean yes if the probability is high enough you can RANDOMLY pick individual cases and your "observation" would be correct about them more often than not, but you can never say this particular case fits the "observation" like most things just because it's typically true...
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Justice for grandmothers!
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This is why we can't have nice things
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WRT Knowledge. I'm not unshakably attached to that definition, but it is generally applicable. I'd like to see the counterexample. Also, a counterexample of the second sort (justified true belief that is somehow not knowledge) doesn't refute that particular claim, it just means there must be an additional component that distinguishes knowledge from other justified, true beliefs. That there may be justified, true belief that is not knowledge does not mean that there is anything called knowledge that is not in the set of justified, true beliefs. I suspect the counterexamples are going to involve a justification that is unrelated to the truth of the matter, and that doesn't count as a justification in my book.
Also, Whoopi Goldberg has grey hair, at least the last time I saw video of her. She is most recently on The View, saying stupid things (for which she may have been fired? Not sure).
I am skeptical that impossible counterexamples can definitively refute a claim. For example, in the series of babies giving birth, it could be the case that the thing that makes it impossible for babies to give birth could be directly connected to, for example, having grey hair, in which case, your impossible example is, in some sense, just assuming the conclusion that the generality is wrong. Facts have to be consulted. Obviously, they're kind of irrelevant in this case, but hopefully the point is clear.
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The "baby giving birth to baby giving birth to baby" is more far-fetched than it really needed to be, but it is closer to possibility than one might imagine. The youngest reliably documented and surviving live birth was by a girl less than 6 years old. Her son died at age 40, but she herself is 89 years old, today. So while it would be an extremely rare set of medical circumstances, it is therefore theoretically possible that someone could be a grandmother at age 12, even before the teen years, bizarre as it is to discover. Even without citing such extreme examples, one could be a grandmother by age 38 with two adult pregnancies and still not have grey hair or an affection for passing out candies.
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I dont understand the reason to use fantastical counter examples when not necessary. Like here, a perfectly logical and real counter example would be that a female can have a baby at 16 yrs old, and that baby has one at 16 yrs old, it happens often. Now you have a 33 yr old grandmother who isnt gray haired or any stereotypes. On the other hand, if one could not find a real counter example and could only come up with a fantasy land one, wouldnt people take them less seriously as a philosopher? Genuinely curious. Watching these videos in order, am not college educated, and highly appreciate you sharing these lectures. Thank you!
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@calorion
1 year ago
So many people I run into seem to have no sense of hypotheticals or counterexamples. I'm going to show the next one of these this video to see if that helps.
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